I don’t do this very often, but…Let us first revisit the lyrics, in full:
You are cool, you are hot
And you know, what you’ve got
You can have anyone
When you call, they will comeBut I won’t be a name upon your list
I have way too much pride to go for this‘Cause I don’t want your lovin’
I don’t want your love
I don’t want your lovin’
I don’t want your loveWhy don’t you tell me goodbye?
When I turn you away
You don’t know what to say
Because nobody ever turned you down
Well I guess you had better learn to frown‘Cause I don’t want your lovin’
I don’t want your love
I don’t want your lovin’
I don’t want your love
Dated 2002. These are the thoughts of a 32-year-old man.
Recently, Rivers Cuomo has explained the schoolyard lyrical subject of songs like “Troublemaker” by citing his interest in playing with the myriad cliches of pop songwriting: adolescence, school, fame, anti-authority, being a “weird kid,” etcetera etcetera. Some might criticize him on this point, as what he does with these cliches is hardly “playing” with them — songs like “Troublemaker” and “Beverly Hills” pretty much embody those cliches, and do precious little to update, alter or manipulate their content.
But “I Don’t Want Your Lovin’” is something else altogether. Everything about this recording screams “junior high songwriting,” from the unfathomably juvenile lyrics to the novice kid’s guitar line, from the predictable melody to the bedroom recording quality (actually, the one sign that this is the work of a grown man is Cuomo’s voice — which, in its isolated maturity, has a pretty creepy effect). And this isn’t just your average case of arrested development — this is coming from a man who, ten years prior, at the spritely age of 22, was penning songs that displayed an awe-inspiring musical depth and an astonishingly acute lyrical maturity. “Purification of Water,” “My Name Is Jonas,” “Only In Dreams,” “Paperface,” “Surf Wax America,” “Say It Ain’t So,” “No One Else,” “Mykel & Carli” — songs that are each a classic in their own rights, and often times in completely disparate musical styles, reflecting a breadth of talent, influence and musical understanding that perhaps surpassed that of any 22-year-old pop/rock songwriter since the ’60s. This was the same Rivers Cuomo that aspired to leave rock’n'roll behind at age 30 and become a classical composer; instead, the 32-year-old Rivers Cuomo of 2002 was composing something you might tell your little brother “doesn’t sound too bad” in comparison to the rest of the tuneless crap on his very first home demo.
The song’s sole redemption comes with the bridge, in which Cuomo gently croons, “Why don’t you tell me goodbye?” It’s the one moment that is actually a bit surprising, and shows a hint of complexity that the rest of the song doesn’t. For the most part, “Lovin’” is a shallow, uncomplicated kiss-off to a pretty slut that wants some of Cuomo’s action, a “revenge of the (6th grade) nerd” banality. But here Cuomo shows a hint of empathy — the girl apparently won’t leave him alone, and he actually starts to pity her a little, and, beneath the guilt being weighed upon him, just wants her to stop. With a little hum and six words, Cuomo manages to convey a relatively complex feeling with great concision. Musically, it’s a respite as well — quite a nice little segment, all around.
Sadly, there’s little else going on here. I mean, sheesh, the number of voice cracks, tripped up tempos and flubbed notes alone make you wonder how a musician and auteur of Cuomo’s class could possibly commit this to tape, let alone dry-heave it upon his audience. Thank heavens no form of this song was ever officially released (even though the Recording History lists roughly a dozen full-band, electric takes in 2003! what the fuck!?), but I find it strange that Cuomo himself went out of his way to leak this to fans online. Pretty much everything here, from songwriting to recording to performance, sinks this one near the very bottom of Weezer’s septic tank.
60 Comments
haha, beginning made me laught. well played. whole post is hilarious. great read. and i totally agree with everything there.
I am seriously the only person that likes this song in the weezer fanbase it seems… LOL
Come on, the Why dont you tell me goodbye? part is beautiful…
I really wonder how the full band version sounded.
“When I turn you away
You don’t know what to say
Because nobody ever turned you down
Well I guess you had better learn to frown” I also like that..
I think the main reason I like this song is I can relate…Hm. One persons coal is another persons treasure.
Haha I love this song. I actually think it sounds like the kind of song Rivers would have written before Blue album. The chorus is a little repetitive, but other than that I definitely enjoy it.
I love this song too, I would love to hear a full band version of it, I think this demo doesn’t do it any real justice, I think with some devolpment this could be a beautiful song
ugh…
You guys are loons; don’t encourage this kind of behavior. And Dan, I gave the “tell me goodbye” part as much credit as it’s worth.
Although I am interested in hearing an electric take of it, just to hear what they found viable in this (as one boardie once hilariously put it) “Adam Sandler throwaway” of a song.
Man, nobody really “tell’s it how it is” about Weezer better than SOYREV. Geffen is probably sending you a “Cease & Desist” as I type this.
Dear Shaun,
Yes! This song could be very beautiful! With new lyrics, structure and arrangement! Err, maybe there was a reason he moved on from this song, eventually.
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again: Worst. Weezer. Song. Ever. This is worse than “We Are All on Drugs”. That’s how fucking bad this song is. And let me also say that I too made the connection between “cool” and “hot” being both temperature ranges and desirable traits. I thought I was quite clever when I figured that one out in elementary school.
If this song was from 1991 I might be able to find some kind of amateurish charm to it, but it isn’t, and therefore I can’t. Utterly feeble.
The “You are cool/You are hot” part is hard to fathom, but I actually think the rest of the lyrics are pretty good.
When I turn you away
You don’t know what to say
Because nobody ever turned you down
Well I guess you had better learn to frown
I think Rivers’ vocals are chilling on this recording. I’m not saying this is a phenomenal song, but to me it feels reminiscent of Cuomo’s earlier compositions; songs like “Wanda”. Granted, “Wanda” is a much better song, but “I Don’t Want Your Lovin” does sound a bit more emotional than most of the 02 stuff.
This beautiful girl who could have anyone actually wants him, but he’d rather be alone. I mean, how Rivers is that? I think saying that “We Are All On Drugs” is better than this song is so far off.
I think what makes this song work, for me at least, is the believability in Rivers’ voice. I feel that this song is actually a rare PP example of Rivers “feeling what he’s singing”. Maybe it’s just me.
I don’t mind this song but agree the lyrics are mostly subpar. Still, there is some good emotion in Rivers’ voice — with reworked lyrics and an interesting full band arangement I think this song could’ve turned into something quite good. How could it be any worse than My Best Friend?
Unbelievable.
Kinda reminds me of a song Elliot Smith might of recorded at an early age, before he actually began to scratch the surface of his potential.
Not that it matters, but I think Smith was a much more talented singer-songwriter than Rivers, judging them on the body of their work.
Despite the early exit, he seemed more measured in the development of his style.
I just can’t believe some of you guys are giving this song a free pass. I try to give every song its due, I even approached this recording with fresh ears, but seriously…How many times have you all force fed yourselves WAOOD and MBF to think this actually a good song? This kind of thing might be refreshing were this an Angels & Airwaves songblog, but this isn’t, because Angels & Airwaves suck. Comparisons to early Elliott Smith or even a 1991 Rivers, whether made disparagingly or not, are completely wasted. Smith went on to write “Between the Bars”; 1991 Rivers went on to write “Purification of Water” the next year. It’s the mind-numbing regression that this song represents that is just so resolutely offensive.
I don’t know what could be offensive about this song, other than the hot/cold issue…it may be a simple tune but how could you deny the emotion in Rivers’ voice? I think this song is quite good in comparison with a lot of the songs from this era.
I know it may be just me, and I’m fine with that. I usually think you’re right on when it comes to this blog, but I think there are tons of Weezer songs that are FAR worse than this, and most of them were recorded in the same era that this little gem (IMO) emerged from.
No chance is this song even near to “bottom of the septic tank” dude! I’ve always liked it. I do agree the lyrics are childish for a 30 something year old man, but it’s always been a nice song, and one of few recent songs where you can actually hear emotion in River’s voice.
For chrissakes, people! Cuomi having emotion in his voice does not guarantee a good song! In fact, with a piece of detritus this poor, it’s actually worse off — it becomes embarrassing. 32-year-old Cuomo is reciting this 6th grade poetry and he’s really feelin’ it? C’mon, guys.
I generally try to respect and value the opinions of others, but this is truly astounding — I’ve never before encountered a more vivid portrait of the Weezer fan’s post-2000 beaten wife complex than I’ve found in this here thread. Holy shit.
But, I won’t beat a dead horse — if someone doesn’t mention a reason they like this sugar booger other than “his voice has emotion in it,” I’ve made my point about that well enough already; if you’re looking for an emotive Cuomo, I can direct you to at least 20 songs that are some million exponents better than this one.
I don’t know…we’re just not on the same page at all here. I’m as big of a critic as anyone regarding Weezer circa 01/02, but this song really stands out to me as something genuinely good.
I do think it’s important that Rivers is displaying some emotion in his voice. That’s really the only thing I like about this song. On paper these lyrics don’t amount to that much but the way he delivers them is what makes this song stand out for me. And at least these lyrics make sense. Shit…compared to most of what became “Maladroit”, they’re practically masterful.
Then again, the song isn’t great enough to really argue about. I’m just gonna put on “Falling For You” and call it a truce.
Fair ‘nough, though I must say your point seems to say much more about Maladroit than it does this song.
Oh, I agree. Maladroit is just that bad. I do like this song, though, just to be clear.
My reason for free pass is like i said I can relate..
I don’t find it half as embarrassing as My Best friend, drugs, or beverly hills..
but w/ez!
Beaten wife complex indeed. Yipes. I fully support this song’s inclusion in The Very Worst.
I had to download it again, because it’s been gone from my hard drive for years. I thought maybe I was remembering it wrong. But no:
The melodies are choppy and obvious. Standard amateur fare.
Furthermore, this is not, I repeat NOT, emotive singing. Try to dislodge Cuomo and Shriner’s wangs from your ears, and this will cease to pass for emotional material. Honestly… this boring delivery through and through. It’s just missing the uber-compressed presentation you’ve become used to on the albums.
The lyrics are painfully dull and simplistic; Full-on bad junior high poetry style… Easily among his worst, even if they’re more cohesive than much Maladroit era writing.
The harmonic background is equally dull and obvious. Even that bridge, which Rev is willing to acknowledge… to me, just sounds like generic “um, this song needs a bridge, so I’ll go to a minor chord!” territory.
Seriously? We’re comparing THIS to Elliott Smith?? Where am I? What’s going on?
(brain explodes)
When I mentioned Elliott Smith I was being disparaging.
I was suggesting a Smith song from him as a 15 year old or something (“kinda reminds me of a song Elliott Smith would have recorded at AN EARLY AGE”) , the point being that Smith progressed while Cuomo has regressed.
Sorry for the confusion.
“Because nobody ever turned you down
Well I guess you had better learn to frown”
is one of the worst, not akward cuomo lines ever.
This is in no way a great song, but I wouldn’t put this at the bottom of the barrel at all.
I’d give it like a 5.3/10. I like this song.
Sure the lyrics are generic (cough last 4 albums cough), it’s a pretty dull overall (cough last 4 albums cough), but like a lot of the songs on the last 4 albums, it’s decent even though it’s got its low points.
I am scared to write any more on this subject in fear of being massacred but here it goes: It’s not a strong song in the Weezer catalogue by any means but I just don’t find it as offensive as a lot of people do. I think it’s a case of potential unrealized but I don’t think it’s much worse than some of the things Weezer ended up releasing officially in the Maladroite and Make Believe eras. I never got the praise for another song from these acoustic demos, Everybody Wants A Chance To Be All Alone. While the full band version Donnie — sorry if I am spelling this wrong, that’s how my narration software pronounces it — from a6.com released totally rocks, I actually found that song to be just as boring as many of you feel this one is.
I guess one man’s treasure is another man’s trash and it just speaks to how dedicated and diverse Weezer fans really are. People wouldn’t be passionately debating this if that weren’t the case and whatever the criticisms, it’s just because we know they can do better… and while I don’t hate this song I can totally agree that the band can do a million times better.
>My reason for free pass is like i said I can relate..
i think anyone could relate. most people just.. don’t want to?
i mean, seriously, if someone showed me these lyrics as something he can “relate to” and wasn’t, like, 14 i would just laugh out loud.
nothing personal. <3
I agree with Jason and Ludicrosity here. I think you have to take a look at this song as it is. It sounds like this is Rivers’ first run-through ever of this song. He wrote/performed it pretty much right after (if not the same day, then the next) the fasting experiment that brought about the original Hold Me.
He didn’t polish up the lyrics or the acoustic performance- he was just putting this out there as it is (hence, the bedroom recording quality). And if you look at the time in his life in which he wrote it, when he was trying to simplify everything, it only makes sense that he would simplify his songwriting also.
Rivers released the original demos of this and Hold Me on the RCB and actually talked about them. And he acknowledged the simplicity of IDWYL:
“i think they’ll get a lot thicker once we play as a band and start overdubbing and stuff. hopefully i’ll write some more satisfying choruses that will stand on their own. *sighs* ”
He also said way back when that IDWYL reminded him of Porcupine. That I really don’t see.
The lyrics are obviously duff and were probably scribbled down in seconds. Fair enough. But there was never enough potential in the song for it to become anything much better. Its not ‘I’d rather sit on a bed of nails naked, listening to Pat sing We Will Rock You, while Rivers set fire to his demos from ’98/’99′ bad, but even with that criteria, its still not very good at all.
Haha, never thought this little harmless song could get so much attention.
I don’t hate it, I don’t love it and I don’t listen to it that often.
But when I do I find myself actually digging some of the melody. The lyrics are Rivers MB era and I don’t like it that much.
I don’t think there’s really much to say about this song because there’s really not much there, just a decent melody with some bad lyrics.
I totally agree with you, Melack.
GumbyTom: Thanks for the interesting bit of history. Wasn’t EWACTFAA released in this way too? Or…?
Also, a little silly to read that Cuomo was struggling to write “more satisfying choruses” for this one and “Hold Me.” If only because we know that, at least with “Hold Me,” he wound up settling with what he already had.
I think, in this situation, banning Melack is the only applicable solution.
Ace, eh? Yeah right kid!
P.S. Is your email an allusion to a Super Nintendo game?
He’s right, ya know.
Melack…really? I assume, knowing a few things you like, you’d probably love this, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qj5FwUXFiaQ .
Sheesh, guys! Melack isn’t even the one being the most supportive of this song. So quick to pounce…
P.P.S. Is albumsix down for everyone?
Yeah, can’t get on A6 for whatever reason.
I realize there are so many low’s in Weezer’s (rivers) library now, it’s sometimes difficult to enjoy the highs. Ya’ know.
WTF?
I didn’t praise this song more than anyone else did?
Hey Chuck I’m happy to announce that “Put Your Hand On My Shoulder” is a favourite of mine.
Even though Good Charlottes version is a total waste of time. (So is Michael Bubles is you happen to stumble upon his cover)
I love that kind of sound of which Paul Anka was one of the greatest songwriters to master.
There’s even some Weezer connection, he once toured together with Buddy Holly
*waiting to be bashed by chuck telling me how cheezy, disneygay and silly Paul Anka is*
Yeah still getting a 403 Forbidden message this morning on a6.com. I want to go back there so I can laugh at others instead of being laughed at for my lack of being offended over this song! lol
“Put Your Head on My Shoulder” of course, my mistake
Paul Anka kicks some serious musical ass.
Didn’t he cover Smells Like Teen Spirit? I am being serious, his last two records were cover albums and he covered a lot of songs from alternative bands. Maybe one day the Canadian crooner will tackle Buddy Holly, Beverly Hills or… I Don’t Want Your Lovin’! (it all comes full circle, people.)
I feel dumb for not knowing who Paul Anka is. Fuck Good Charlotte, and their horrendous cover of “El Scorcho,” though.
Soy:
Sorry I didn’t answer sooner- went on vacation and then to Detroit to see the show with my Weezer-hating wife. And now I can’t read about what’s been going on because the boards are down.
Anyway, EWACTFAA and the acoustic PM were released sometime in the fall of ’02. I think they surfaced on the WIDF forum, not the RCB. After those two were released, the band kept things hush-hush for the rest of the year. Then one night in early March, Rivers showed up on the RCB and offered a new song (the first demo of Hold Me) to whoever was the first to message him on AIM. The next night, he signed on again and released IDWYL and stayed on the board a few hours to talk about it. The only reason I was up at the time was because I had just gotten home from a Rilo Kiley show.
What’s WIDF stand for? And did they surface via Rivers/Karl, or were they leaked by a third party?
And, well, shit. Does anyone have a link to the conversations Cuomo had on the RCB about “Hold Me” and IDWYL?
hey Ace. If you’re really Rivers, i want to be able to tell my kids I said hi to Rivers Cuomo one time.
WIDF, I think stood for the Weezer Introspective Discussion Forum. It was also a closed board. Not sure how the acoustic PM and EWACTFAA were leaked. I just remember one day they were out there.
Sadly, the RCB was taken down after the positive response to Make Believe. Ridd has an archive of some of the threads, but it ends in July ’02. I (via copy-and-paste to notepad) saved some of what Rivers said about Hold Me and IDYWL, but there’s little frame of reference to it. Still, if you want it, here it is (now that I think about it, here lies the earliest reference to the Hootenanny experiment):
“cuomosan” on aim for an mp3.
—
426 Hold Me is the new song
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i’ll probably try to cobble a band together and record a rock version today.
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1. i don’t believe those of you that say you like the song.
2. those of you that actually do like the song will hate it in a week.
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heh. that’s [december] one of the songs that rick wants to do with an orchestra/acoustic.
[next day-also talking about the recording of the electric Hold Me]
this song is definitely gya but its cool.
—
rick hates @#%$. he loves extremely simple, emotionally direct words.
bring it on.
there’s hope for me yet.
thank frickin’ god.
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well, i know it’s not great, but it doesn’t totally blow.
i need to get more of that romantic longing back in the melody. that only happens when i’m infatuated with someone and i can’t imagine that happening now. i’m so totally over girls.
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439 kind of reminds me of porcupine. man, i can’t tell you guys how fun those maladroit sessions were. i can’t wait to get to work again.
it’s me and scott and 3 other dudes.
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yeah, the lead playing on this has a little of that feeling of romantic longing.
—
i think brian will be back in the picture soon.
—
this guitar player was GREAT though.
it’s fun to play with a really big band but i never have any idea what’s going to happen. it’s just jam time.
i’m open to anything. you guys can come jam with us at rehearsal if you want.
it’d be cool to get like 50 people in the room all jamming the same song.
i think they’ll get a lot thicker once we play as a band and start overdubbing and stuff. hopefully i’ll write some more satisfying choruses that will stand on their own. *sighs*
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i think it’s swinging back a little bit. (to answer the question: is the pendulum ever gonna swing back to the “contrived” songwriting style? these seem pretty on the “instinctual” side of things. )
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neither of those songs are explicitly about girls.
That’s extremely interesting. Although Cuomo had to have been joking (or else, ridiculously delusional) when he said neither song is “explicitly about girls.” Okay, you could make a tenable (though weak) argument for that in honor of “Hold Me,” but “I Don’t Want Your Lovin’” not about a girl? What else then, Rivdawg?
Interesting about “December,” and again the aborted 2003/2004 orchestral/acoustic album. Perhaps that record could’ve been something nice.
Oh, and Jason, don’t be fooled; I doubt Ace is Rivers, considering the email he uses and the fact that he just left a comment on “Peace” calling it unbelievably sterile.
I actually really love this song. It’s simple and juvenile, yes, but the simplicity and the fact that there is a bit of complexity beneath the initial reaction make it a wonderful song.
Maybe I’m looking too far into it, but I like the melody, and the lyrics are rather pleasant.
I legitimately love this songs melody. I just skimmed the comments and came across one that said it was reminiscent of Blue.. I totally agree. It’s got that nursery rhyme sing song melody that so recalls In The Garage or Mykel and Carli. I think it could have turned into something great with the right production.. granted the lyrics do suck.
Someone mentioned earlier in this thread that Donny did a cover of Everybody Wants a Chance to Feel All Alone. Anyone have a copy of this they wouldn’t mind uploading??
It’s not often I can help out a fellow Weez fan attain something that they don’t have and I do. So I uploaded the Everybody Wants A Chance To Feel All Alone cover to sendspace for you:
http://www.sendspace.com/file/a2arsp
Happy listening!
A rare appearance by Ludicrosity! Rejoice!
Also, Donny’s cover is pretty fantastic. Also something to rejoice about, if you’ve never heard it.
Thanks!!
“A rare appearance by Ludicrosity! Rejoice!”
I may not comment often but I am… always… watching. I’d say I keep closer tabs on this blog than a6 but I still lurk about. Just haven’t had much of a reason to comment on anything… although that Homie tribute on a6 brought me out of hiding: It was fantastic.
Anyway thanks for the rejoicing and no problemo on the mp3 newbcakes. I <3 you all.
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